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Smooth bore testing
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Booshway
posted
Fellow muzzleloading enthusiasts,

If time, tractor repairs, greatly needed fence repairs and weather allow this weekend, I plan to experiment a bit with my .62 fowler. These idealistic goals of experimenting with the .62 smooth bore make take more weekends than I anticipate. Also, in the mix is that my .62 barrel is jug choked. LOTS of variables to work out.

I already have a stand-by turkey load for when season opens. However, since I developed my stand-by load, I have read about different loads with different shot sizes, shot cup material and shape, and types of shot. I plan to experiment mostly with a couple of different shot sizes but I acquired some of that new fangled TSS shot in #9 size and have a few different wads, patch and/or shot cup materials to play with. I may even play with some different buffers like corn meal and the artificial stuff.

I did find some TSS plastic wads that, sure enough, fit my bore snugly but with enough give to slide down with a bit of effort.

I have read and heard much interweb traffic about "plastic yea/nay in a muzzleloader barrel", "TSS harming a muzzleloader barrel", "Shot cups V/S no shot cups", "jug choke with/without shot cups", "buffered/not buffered shot", etc., etc.

Lots of discussion out there but nothing I have read is difinitive on any of the said topics. I said to myself; I said, "Self, why dont' you find out for yourself the ins and outs of above said topics". So....Over time I plan to find out my own self.

I will provide feed-back as I have some to share. I suggest you all experiment a bit with smooth bores and get back to us all about your findings.

Curious,
DanL


God bless America and Alba Gu Brath!
 
Posts: 567 | Location: God's farm in Alabama | Registered: 07 December 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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I, too, have a .62 fowler that I am quite fond of. I have taken deer with it using a patched .60 round ball. I have also experimented with "buck and ball" loads.
However, although I have run small shot through it, I have never really tried to find the optimum shot load for small game or turkeys. I have intended to do just that for some time now, but other projects keep popping up and so I just never seem to get around to it.
I currently have #7 1/2 and #6 shot, but I like #5 for turkey, which I don't have.


Know what you believe in. Fight for your beliefs. Never compromise away your rights.
 
Posts: 1296 | Location: Cherokee Land, Tenasi | Registered: 06 January 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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Well folks, I have been performing a little research and investigation.

I want to find out more about using TSS Shot in muzzleloaders. I have found only a small bit of actual field tests that people are willing to publish at least. Even that information is lacking in details.

I have compared TSS shot to lead shot by weight and by volume. I have an antique shot measuring dipper that has adjustable volumes from 1 ounce by volume of shot up to 1 5/8 oz of shot. I also have my adjustable powder measure that goes from 20 grains to 120 grains by volume. In addition, I have an excellent electronic scale that I can set to grams, grains or ounces.

I measured one oz by volume of TSS shot with the antique measure and weighed it. It actually weighed 1.75 oz. I then placed the 1.75 oz of TSS shot in my powder measure and adjusted it to level top. It measured 70 grains by volume.

Then, I weighed 1 oz of TSS and put it in my powder measure. It came to the equivalent of 40 grains. So....in order to know what other amount I might like to try as a load, I measured 1.5 oz by weight of TSS shot and put it in my powder measure. It came to 60 grains by volume.

Now when I get the chance I know I can measure by volume with my powder measure; 40 grains is 1 oz of TSS, 60 grains is 1.5 oz of TSS, and 70 grains is 1.75 oz of TSS.

I can now extrapolate most any size TSS load from this information right at my shooting bench or in the field.

Figuring things out,
DanL


God bless America and Alba Gu Brath!
 
Posts: 567 | Location: God's farm in Alabama | Registered: 07 December 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Factor
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Good stuff, Maynard!


Beer is proof that God loves us,and wants us to be happy-B. Franklin
 
Posts: 2014 | Location: Oreegun Territory | Registered: 24 March 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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Well....Tractor and fence repairs prevented me from playing with the smooth bore this past weekend.

However, this will allow me more time to get organized as to a strategy for actually performing the experiments.

Be safe out there,
DanL


God bless America and Alba Gu Brath!
 
Posts: 567 | Location: God's farm in Alabama | Registered: 07 December 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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Good morning.

Some folks need/want non-lead shot options. I have performed a bit of research with very little information forthcoming about using TSS in traditional smoothbores. Folks say it will ruin you barrel or the plastic shotgun wads will melt and leave nasty residue in your barrel. Well, I ran a couple of test on my Chambers .62 English officers fusil with a 41” barrel which is jug choked.

I acquired some #9 TSS, some non-slit plastic 20 gauge shotgun wads designed for TSS and a plastic shotgun wad slitter.

I compared weight to volume for TSS with a digital scale and my standard powder measure. I found:

1 ounce (by weight) of TSS = 40 grains (by volume) in my powder measure
1.5 oz ( by weight) of TSS = 60 grains (by volume)
1.75 oz ( by weight) of TSS = 70 grains ( by volume)

I tested several loads but here is my best load so far: (30 yards distance).

70 grains FFG Goex powder
1 1/8” nitro card edge lubed with Mr. Flintlock lube
1 1/8” wool felt wad lightly lubed with Mr. Flintlock lube
1 plastic shotgun wad (for TSS) slit fully and trimmed to length of shot column
70 grains #9 TSS
1 over shot card

My target was a large sheet of light cardboard with a lovely turkey image drawn on it. Turkey’s neck is about 10” for perspective.

As you can see, the pattern is pretty good at 30 yards. This is only the results of my testing with my flintlock smoothbore. Your mileage may vary.

No evidence of burning/melting plastic wads.
No evidence of plastic residue in barrel.
Wads have powder residue staining but could be used again.
No evidence of TSS dimpling the wads.
No evidence of damage to the barrel.
Jug choke did not appear to have influenced the pattern using plastic shotgun wads.


God bless America and Alba Gu Brath!


 
Posts: 567 | Location: God's farm in Alabama | Registered: 07 December 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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TSS wad after firing.


God bless America and Alba Gu Brath!


 
Posts: 567 | Location: God's farm in Alabama | Registered: 07 December 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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Field testing of this TSS load:


God bless America and Alba Gu Brath!


.62 smoothbore: #9 TSS shot
 
Posts: 567 | Location: God's farm in Alabama | Registered: 07 December 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Factor
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I suppose I'm showing my ignorance,but WHAT is TSS? Is it that shot they came up with made from Bismuth?


Beer is proof that God loves us,and wants us to be happy-B. Franklin
 
Posts: 2014 | Location: Oreegun Territory | Registered: 24 March 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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Hi Boartooth. TSS is a fairly new material used to make shotgun shot. It is harder and more dense than lead. It is very expensive.

From the TSS manufacturer:

"At 18g/cc (about 60% denser than lead), the penetration energy is so high that it enables one to go down significantly in pellet size, to greatly increase the pellet count and pattern density, while simultaneously increasing the penetration depth of the pellets into the target."
"As for comparing 18g/cc tungsten pellets vs lead (11g/cc), a Super-18 pellet will have about the same penetration energy as a lead pellet 5 sizes larger. So, a Super-18 #9 pellet will penetrate into soft matter at approximately the same depth as a Lead #4 pellet. However, in real life scenarios, on real birds, the Super-18 will actually do better vs lead, because of hardness. It will break bones better, or any other hard material, because of it's hardness and lack of flattening out when it comes into contact with any surface."

DanL


God bless America and Alba Gu Brath!
 
Posts: 567 | Location: God's farm in Alabama | Registered: 07 December 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Factor
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Hmm, thanks for sharing. I imagine Tungsten IS more expensive than lead....I'm going to have to give it some thought.


Beer is proof that God loves us,and wants us to be happy-B. Franklin
 
Posts: 2014 | Location: Oreegun Territory | Registered: 24 March 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Factor
Picture of Hanshi
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My smoothbore is a .62 with both front and rear sights. I've killed deer with it but no turkey. A patched .600" lead ball is accurate - 2" to 3" groups at 50 yards. I've found that anywhere from 60-70 grains of 3F gives power and accuracy. I no longer hunt so turkey will be pretty safe from me.


*Young guys should hang out with old guys; old guys know stuff.*
 
Posts: 3559 | Location: Maine (by way of Georgia then Va.) | Registered: 26 January 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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