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The decline of traditional black powder hunting & shooting
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Greenhorn
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Our muzzleloader club just held its frozen toe event this past weekend,we had 8 primitive campers and a total of 16 shooters for the weekend.
 
Posts: 29 | Location: Central Pa. | Registered: 02 October 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Greenhorn
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An interesting and important topic, and one I have thought on now and then over the past several years. I have noticed that my nephews in the 20-40 age range seem to have little free time available to them, they seemed wrapped up all the time with demanding careers and when they are not working their kids have all sorts of activities that as parents they need to attend or act as chaffeurs, they don't have the time to hunt or fish, even if they have the interest.

Where I work we have a number of mechanics in the 20-35 age range, they seem to me to be glued to their smart phones, texting constantly, and the under 20 crowd is if anything even worse with their phones and pads. I think many would just as soon have their head's hard wired onto digital devices so they could be contantly conected, maybe that is the furure, and if it is, I want no part of it. I want to use technology, not become a device.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: will5a1,
 
Posts: 7 | Location: SW Ohio | Registered: 25 March 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
Picture of Idaho Mountainneer
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Will, that's why I love where I live, we don't even have cell service. Being in that 20-35 age group I've always been kinda the oddball of my peers. I didn't get my own cell phone until I was twenty and the main reason I got that was for emergencies when I went camping by myself, if I even had cell service.
I agree about using technology and not abusing it. Look at the car, what a useful tool, but then you either get some dumb kid or a drunk behind the wheel and you've got trouble.
I often wonder what would happen if we lost our technology.That's a big reason why I want to be a good woodsman and learn not to depend on tech to survive. Do I like my tech? Well obviuosly because I'm writing this post right now. But if I lost it I sure hope I could live without it.
I was talking to one of my co-workers yesterday and he said he knew a guy who brought a friend out here to the ranch. His friend couldn't stop checking his phone every five minutes and saying "how can you live out here without cell phones?"
Personally I say it's nice and peaceful.
 
Posts: 330 | Location: Twin Falls ID | Registered: 29 January 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
<mtnmike>
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I have survived for 62 years without a cell phone,I think I can make it the rest of the way without one,,if the Missus decides to drop internet,I will probably make it,but I do enjoy talking with you all from different places Big Grin
 
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Booshway
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We don't have a cell phone, no cell service where I live anyway. the only reason I have this computer is my wife wanted to be able to e-mail her friends so she got satellite internet. That's the only kind we can get here. It costs money so I'm determined to get some use out of it, but I'd be just as happy and waste less time if we didn't have it.
 
Posts: 507 | Registered: 14 August 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Factor
Picture of Hanshi
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I always refused to get a cell phone until I was in my mid 50s. I have zero sense of direction and get lost constantly. Now that I don't drive (other than to doc visits,the range,etc) I don't get lost as much as I use to. My wife made me take one so I could call her when I got lost and needed more directions.

I don't like this dependence upon technology. We're one large electromagnetic pulse from the next stone age. This scares me. This is the allure of muzzleloaders; a link back to a more "civilized" and simple time. I come from the outhouse/wood kitchen stove/heating with potbellied stove/no labor saving devises era. My wife, several years younger than myself, says I'm like someone who grew up in the depression. Well, we were poor; we just didn't know it. Ask young folks today what a "party line" is; it's a great laugh.


*Young guys should hang out with old guys; old guys know stuff.*
 
Posts: 3559 | Location: Maine (by way of Georgia then Va.) | Registered: 26 January 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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Very well put, Hanshi. I'm from that same outhouse- wood stove- raise and hunt your own food background and so is my wife. We haven't changed much.
 
Posts: 507 | Registered: 14 August 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Factor
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Being a Navy Brat,I've been tied to various port cities most of my growing up life.The rest of it has been trying to get away from cities,my teens and early 20's,I lived on a small farm near a city.we went as basic as possible,both of my parents were Depression kids.A combination of living close to a city,and ,I think,my Dad's experiences in WWll meant no hunting in my youth.I hate cell phones,but my wife put me in a choke hold and forced me to get one when she was traveling to sell her jewelry.Now,well, habits are hard to break,but I don't think it would be hard to adapt back.I go back and forth on the utility of the internet,I would miss you all though....


Beer is proof that God loves us,and wants us to be happy-B. Franklin
 
Posts: 2014 | Location: Oreegun Territory | Registered: 24 March 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Greenhorn
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For me, like Hanshi, traditional muzzleloaders allows me to make some sort of connection to the past, a past that is important, or at least I think it is. I know I am a better hunter using a sidelock rifle, choosing my shots carefully, and learning as much as I can about the game I am hunting, paying attention to the land, wind, non-game animals and birds makes my time in the woods very special to me. My sense is that most modern American's are pretty far removed from how I, and those of us here, think.

I think most younger folks like being interconnected and interdependent, they don't value self-reliance as much as some of us do, and I know I am painting with a very broad brush when I say that and there are exceptions. I know with all things technical I am way behind most, I'll use a cell phone but I won't text (I am always amazed at how fast a 15 year old can text out a message, their fingers fly), I like the internet in small doses, maybe because I have real world things I have to attend to. So many younger folks seem, to me, to be more in their virtual digital world than real, maybe it is real for them, I don't know.

Like some of you posted above I am also concerned with our dependence on technology, I wish more people would take up gardening, and learn how to use basic hand tools, and just generally become more self reliant. Last month I had the pleasure of showing a nephew how to sharpen a knife, he is 28 and no one ever took the time to show him. Last fall I showed him how to make cornbread, in a cast iron skillet, and whenever we get together I try to pass on some practical skill, but he is the only one that has any interest. Maybe I shouldn't worry about lost skills, and lost history, I don't know, everything changes, I am not sure it is for the better though.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: will5a1,
 
Posts: 7 | Location: SW Ohio | Registered: 25 March 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Free Trapper
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I believe that it is today's tough economy that keeps the younger folks from getting into this hobby\lifestyle\sport. Raising four sons to adulthood, I have watched them all struggle just to make a basic home for themselves and their newly started families. It was tough for me as well just starting out in the early 1970's but there were more opportunities in those days. Not as much competition to get your foot in the door of a career type of job. Today, most of those full time with benefits jobs are gone. Around here nearly everything has gone to part time minimum wages. Now that I think about it, I was well into middle age before I even considered any kind of a hobby at all! Finding myself able to get onto this fine road to learning and historic adventure couldn't come until I had conquered life's basics. The way I see it, our traditional ways will not expand until the young ones are ready to take them on. Some of them who have already experienced living with us old timers, will at least have the general idea. Then as we go on to our rewards in the hereafter, we leave behind those smoke poles and accoutrements that will be picked up by those few to take our place.
 
Posts: 197 | Registered: 15 January 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
Picture of andy*
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Went to the Cascade Mountain Men show this weekend. It was excellent as always. Lots of traditional folks there, gives me hope in-spite of my first post in this thread.
On both days I saw both old and young people, knowledgeable dealers answering questions and fair prices plus a few outright steals.
I hope that the new folks I saw there take up our hobby...it seemed that the interest was there.
Andy


Follow me I am the Infantry
 
Posts: 668 | Location: Everson, Washington | Registered: 27 June 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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Andy: I was there also. I had lots of company accompany me too. My good friend and his wife, My nephew and his 8 yr old, and my son's soon to be, and a friend of hers.

My friend and his wife didn't buy much but enjoyed the show. He is a blacksmith and boiler tender by trade.

My nephew bought a caplock pistol and a few other supplies.

My son's soon to be bought a traditional arrow quiver, a very nice powder horn, and some jewelry. Her friend bought a ring and spent her time renewing old acquaintance's since she has been rondying since she was 14.

I didn't buy much other than a few supplies and meeting old friends.

I looked for some books but what I was looking for wasn't on the book sellers table.

For the sake of this discussion, It was great to see my son's soon to be continuing to try to improve her meager outfit. It shows she is still interested and planning on continuing.

She has a very busy life since she just got her teaching license and is now substituting in hopes of getting a teaching position next fall.

Yup, one more teacher that loves history and understands that guns aren't bad.

Load fast and aim slow.
 
Posts: 1726 | Location: Pacific Northwest | Registered: 08 March 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
Picture of andy*
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Glad to hear you brought out folks White Finger.
I teach as well and have taken a student out shooting and hunting a time or two.
At the risk of making the admin mad I would like to put out a plug for ruxtonmuseum.org
This a blog that a friend and I have. We talk about old guns and shooting. When we go to a event we have folks handle old guns, answer questions and if we can have them shoot a antique firearm.
We have guns ranging from the 1780's to the 1880's.
We started this blog just to drum up interest in traditional blackpowder shooting and hunting.
Andy


Follow me I am the Infantry
 
Posts: 668 | Location: Everson, Washington | Registered: 27 June 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Greenhorn
Picture of Stone Fence
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andy* makes a good point - teaching others about our traditions is a good way to keep what we do going. Personally, I've started trying to get more people interested by taking them out and sharing what I know about traditional muzzleloading. Too often they don't understand what to do or how to do it but once they learn, want to continue on.


My God! How little do my countrymen know what precious blessings they are in possession of, and which no other people on earth enjoy! ~Thomas Jefferson
 
Posts: 27 | Location: Southern Minnesota | Registered: 20 February 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
Picture of MountainRanger
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That's the thing about our way of shooting (at least, that's what happened to me in 1975)... if we can get a newbie out to at least watch a bunch of us primitives, or kind-of primitives, they will probably want to shoot one. Once they feel that comfortable bump against their shoulder, smell the burning black powder, see the smoke, then see the ball maybe go exactly or at least close to where they want it to, they tend to be hooked. More sooner than later they show up with their own firestick. You know, if we can all just recruit one newbie a year to the sport then put it on them to recruit one a year we won't be discussing a decline of traditional black powder shooting. That will be my goal for this year.. at least one newbie to the sport. Smiler


Sua Sponte
 
Posts: 460 | Location: SW Virginia (New River Valley) | Registered: 13 August 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Factor
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Good on ya,mate....


Beer is proof that God loves us,and wants us to be happy-B. Franklin
 
Posts: 2014 | Location: Oreegun Territory | Registered: 24 March 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Hivernant
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I haven't been here in a while, so, I'm sorry.
But, I have to say....Anyone with any kind of muzzleloader is welcome at MY fire.
How many of you started with a musket or sidelock T/C ? You "progressed" to flintlock and maybe started going to 'vous ?
YOU are the demise of rondi - traditional muzzleloading. Most are un-inclusive and act aloof towards pilgrims...I have watched it time after time....Youngins' just walk off..Young people afraid to ask questions for fear of ridicule....On visitors day we should have "helpers" walking with interested parties but No...we all moan and groan about visitors to camp...Take a look at camp...all old folks and only a few new ones who are our own children...
I believe that the in-line shooters will want to know more...and "progress" on their own.
OH, And we make it too expensive too.....
So, now, go ahead and spend 50 lines telling me how I'm wrong.....But I ain't.


Keep inside the tree line, Don't let 'em know where yer bedded. Some have less than you do and my be inclined to try and take what little ya have.
 
Posts: 107 | Location: The Soviet Socialist state of Connectitax | Registered: 29 May 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Booshway
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Everyone's opinions are shaped by their own experiences so we all have our own ideas, but I've never been to a rendezvous where there wasn't plenty of people willing to help newcomers to get started or any one with a problem. And rather than me spending 50 lines telling you how you are wrong I would rather you spend whatever you need telling me how I make anything expensive.
 
Posts: 507 | Registered: 14 August 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Factor
Picture of Hanshi
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I may be wrong but I think what Jimbow is referring to is the tendency to condemn the cheaper factory rifles and convince newbies they must buy a $$$ custom gun in order to not be the object of gossip around camp. I've owned/enjoyed many inexpensive factory guns and only one (early 1970s) was not satisfactory. I still have two I like a great deal and morn 4 I didn't want to sell but simply had to. At one point I was forced to part with a splendid custom.

Factory sidelocks, even those such as Traditions, CVA, etc, are usually THE most logical choice for a beginner and there is NO shame attached to them. The constant wail of, "save a few more dollars and get a really good one" is, when examined, rather snobbish. We need to do better; I need to do better.


*Young guys should hang out with old guys; old guys know stuff.*
 
Posts: 3559 | Location: Maine (by way of Georgia then Va.) | Registered: 26 January 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Factor
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Being a beginner myself,I have to toss in my two pence. I've only been to a few(less than 5) rondies.It was as a visitor,not a participant since I haven't actually decided to go to that length yet.My experience as a visitor was that if I just wandered around and was a "lookie loo"most of the participants just ignored me.However,if I approached folks who were participating and showed interest in what they specifically were doing,they transformed into my new best friend. I think it's a two way street.If I show up at a Rondie with an in-line muzzle-loader and start asking questions about how to "get started" I have every confidence that someone would take me under their wing,and start explaining things.....Now,I'm having some difficulty getting started with the local reenacter group,but that's at least partly my fault;I work nights,and can't go to meetings,and also I haven't got my "uniform" together either to show my interest.I have started getting flyers about local "doin's",and, eventually,my free time,and a local event will coincide and I'll be accepted as a "local"....


Beer is proof that God loves us,and wants us to be happy-B. Franklin
 
Posts: 2014 | Location: Oreegun Territory | Registered: 24 March 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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